14 replies to this topic

[FamilyTreeClimber]

Is Styrofoam banned where you live?  Last year, my county banned it for restaurant use.  The ban goes into full effect January 1st.

I've been intrigued by the different containers that restaurants are switching to.  It seems there are quite a lot of options for them.  Some are using the Chinese food cartons.  A couple have switched to recycled plastic containers by companies like the Bottle Box Co.  

Today, I saw a different one.  It was a square box with a lid just like the Styrofoam containers.  However, this was a paper product made from the same thick cardboard like material that some fast food restaurants use for soft drink cups.  It was sturdy and much less flexible than the Styrofoam containers.

The only thing I worried about was drippings.  If you had something like gravy in the container would it seep through since it's only cardboard?

Anyway, it's interesting to see all the options that are available.  I read that this was going to be too difficult for companies, but I've always wondered why more companies didn't use the containers like Chinese restaurants use.

[Shortpoet-GTD]

It's everywhere here. Sometimes when I get deli salads for lunch on the go; they have cardboard bowls with lids;
so I just put the salad stuff in there rather than use Styrofoam.
I just rinse it out and recycle it.

[FamilyTreeClimber]

Shortpoet, The bans are spreading across California.  I'm not really sad to see Stryofoam phased out.  I've never liked the way it feels when I touch it. And, it makes that squeaky noise sometimes.  (I know, I am weird.)

I tried to find the container that my Mom brought home on the web, but couldn't.  However, I found an interesting company called the Good Start Packaging Company.  They offer "environmentally friendly alternatives to disposable plastic".  What I saw on their website was that most of their food containers are made from sugar cane (the descriptions say "leftover" and "surplus").

They have some plastic like containers made from something called Polactic Acid, which the website says is plant based.  While these are biodegradable, they aren't compostable.  The sugar cane containers are compostable.

http://shop.goodstar...amshells_c5.htm

[Shortpoet-GTD]

They featured those sugar cane packages on a program on Planet Green when it first started up.
A restrauant owner (a woman-ahem ) used them. She composted all of the cafe's food scraps, paper
napkins, recycled her wine bottles.
The "waste" part of her weekly trash was very small. I hope more people get onto that. Thanks for the post.

[E3 wise]

Wow

Here is south florida, no such luck, Stryofoam is still widely used, which is sad because you guys are right, there are lot of differant containers options avalible.

As far as the drippings two of these types of products that I found are using a plant based material to line the inside, one for hot, the other for cold.

[Shortpoet-GTD]

What's really nuts is even Asian places here use that junk-instead of the old cardboard type; which can be
rinsed out and recycled.

[r. zimm]

Part of the problem with any material for use on site is the time it takes the staff to rinse after sorting through the trash placed there by "the public." I would not like that job!

There should be other aspects to this solution like a sink where customers can rinse off their containers and utensils and place them in separate bins. If they did it right I bet people would get on board with the plan and even teach their kids to do it for them!

[Shortpoet-GTD]

r. zimm, on 23 November 2012 - 04:05 PM, said:

Part of the problem with any material for use on site is the time it takes the staff to rinse after sorting through the trash placed there by "the public." I would not like that job!

There should be other aspects to this solution like a sink where customers can rinse off their containers and utensils and place them in separate bins. If they did it right I bet people would get on board with the plan and even teach their kids to do it for them!

Too much water wasted. I would bet 98% would use too much water.
Milk comes in cardboard cartons, why not use it instead of Styrofoam? Or sugar cardboard.

[FamilyTreeClimber]

Remember that these are take home containers, so the restaurant isn't going to deal with them once they are out the door.  I suspect their biggest problem is cost.  Styrofoam containers probably come very cheap.  They really aren't the best option though.  Juice will leak out of the clam shell type.  And, you can't microwave styrofoam, so there's no convenience for the customer.

Shortpoet, I am not sure about other Asian food restaurants because I don't eat at them, but most Chinese food restaurants I've gotten take out from still use the cardboard cartons.  They even make them without the metal handle that used to be so common.  They work fine for drippy, hot food.  A milk carton type container would be perfect, too..  We should invent that for take out food!

[r. zimm]

Most fast food places I have ever been use similar serving ware whether it's take away of dine in. You are right about the water and it's the same amount whether it is used at the site or at the home. My point was just that there are other factors involved other than just the eco-friendliness of the material itself.

For example where I live in SE Florida I have to thoroughly rinse anything that goes into the recycle bins or it attracts bugs (ant big time) and worse raccoons! So there are additional "costs" no mater what materials you use and some are overall better because of cost, ease of cleaning and value in the recycle stream. I could be styrofoam is the least of all evils.

They did a BIG study a few years ago as to what use the land south of Lake Okeechobee whould have the least detrimental environmental impact. So after years of study and God knows how many millions of tax dollars do you what they found? The least detrimental thing to do with the land was to - grow sugarcane! Hey, that's what they are doing already and have been for 60 years! ACK!

That's right, the sugarcane was not only saving the soil from erosion but filtering the water too. Problem was that the government had already committed to buy up the sugarcane fields because everyone thought that sugarcane was bad. Growing sugarcane is actually better than doing nothing!

It just gives me a headache, you know?

[FamilyTreeClimber]

I understand your point.  But, I'm not sure I could find an argument for the benefits of styrofoam.  I believe it makes up something like 30% of landfill space.  Unless it's the biodegradable type made of cornstarch (most is petroleum based) it doesn't break down and can't be recycled.  So, comparing that to rinsing off stuff to be tossed into your recycling bin, doesn't seem equal to me.

And, don't think I don't understand your problem!  We seem to be part of a major ant thruway.  Usually we don't have a problem with our cans.  Our recycling company does not require rinsing or emptying items and most food goes into our green bin.  So, there is no rinsing for the purpose of recycling or composting. But, every now and then, the ants will find something of particular interest.  Then, they are in our cans by the millions.  They can really be a nuisance.

We also have raccoons, opossum, and squirrels in our area.  So far, none seem interested in the cans.  (I knocked on wood...LOL)  Though, we do have a squirrel who is hiding fruit and peanuts in our potted plants lately.

It is interesting about the sugar cane research.  What I would like to know is once they did the study, what did they do?  Did they leave the land as is with sugar cane growing on it?  Or, did they determine to do what they had set out to do in the beginning and ignore the report?

[Shortpoet-GTD]

FamilyTreeClimber, on 24 November 2012 - 11:43 PM, said:

Shortpoet, I am not sure about other Asian food restaurants because I don't eat at them, but most Chinese food restaurants I've gotten take out from still use the cardboard cartons.  They even make them without the metal handle that used to be so common.  They work fine for drippy, hot food.  A milk carton type container would be perfect, too..  We should invent that for take out food!

It's funny because the Asian market I shop at sometimes, sell the cardboard ones but the Oriental cafe I buy
veggie spring rolls from uses the sty junk.

[FamilyTreeClimber]

Shortpoet, interesting!  I have always associated those little cartons with Chinese food restaurants.  Now I see they mostly come without the metal handle.  That makes it easier for recycling, I think.

Can a cardboard container really be that much more expensive than a styrofoam one?

[r. zimm]

Well you are lucky you do not have to rinse the recyclables like we do. We have big momma raccoons who will do just about anything to get food for the family.

We had one tear up our patio screen trying to get to the trash can. Since then I have been very careful about sealing up the trash bags and washing out all recyclables and they have stayed away but have gone next door and bothered them. I told my neighbor about the past history so he will do the same now to avoid the problem.

[ChanellG]

FamilyTreeClimber, on 16 November 2012 - 12:22 AM, said:

Is Styrofoam banned where you live?  Last year, my county banned it for restaurant use.  The ban goes into full effect January 1st.

I wish! I hate styrofoam (for so many reasons). Those Chinese food containers keep the food perfectly hot for a long time, there's no reason why more places couldn't use them.

I also like the compostable paperboard containers Whole Foods has by the salad bar and deli. They almost look like paper mache. I've been repurposing them for growing stuff temporarily. They hold up pretty well to moisture.