20 replies to this topic

[Shortpoet-GTD]

Our celebrations of the 4th often include setting off fireworks, but most (if not all) are
made in Asian countries and shipped here. Not green whatsoever.

Flying an "American" flag? You'd be hard pressed to find one that is actually
made in America. Shipping emissions.

Bar B Que? Hamburgers and hot dogs are two favorites for most holiday cookouts-
and we know the environmental costs of those items. GHG emissions, water wasted
and shipping.

Disposable utensils, (that type of plastic cannot be easily recycled)-
paper plates that can't be recycled because of food stains on them, commonly used at picnics;
disposable plastic or styrofoam cups, charcoal briquettes, toxic chemicals to keep the
mosquitoes at bay.

Traveling by car or plane to celebrate at another location. Emissions.

Is it possible to have a green 4th of July celebration?

[QuatreHiead]

I suppose it is possible if you are willing to go the extra mile and not at all be very traditional. I suppose the burgers and hot dogs could be left in, by not grilling them but preparing them in home to avoid so much of the GHG emission etc. They would be a bit more expensive, but if you knew of a local producer of the meats that would avoid the whole manufactured sale.

Also if you're willing to stick close to home to avoid so much travel emission from car and plane, then using plates at home that you're willing to clean by hand. I suppose it could be a team effort as long as that isn't considered rude by friends and family. Keeping it small and playing games in the backyard and enjoying the warm summer evening would be simplistic but can still be great fun. Perhaps even take a minute to do crafts where you have your own American made American flags made up quickly by getting together to make one best you can.

Those are the only suggestions I can offer and most are likely a bit crude. Let me know if you shoot for doing a "green" 4th of July. But I assume this is mostly speculation.

[FamilyTreeClimber]

I guess you could sit in a corner in the dark with the lights off with one of those blowers with the streamers on the end. ;)  I think it is possible to have a "greener".  Stay home and have a nice dinner.  Use your regular plates, glasses, and silverware.  Any paper products that you use recycle them.  Instead of driving to the fireworks shows, climb up on the roof of the garage and watch.  It won't be zero emission, but is any celebration?

Fireworks are illegal in my county, but people get them because of neighboring areas that do sell them..  I really hope that people use their common sense this year.  It was a dry year with below average rainfall.  The hills around the Bay Area have been dry and brown for weeks.  People's yards showed their Summer brown several weeks early.  It won't take much for some areas to burn.

[dconklin]

For us it is not as bad as this.  Some people in certain towns are not even allowed to wave the American flag anymore.  The building down the road from me was planning to evict a woman who refused to take her small flags down.  They said it violated the lease

Anyway, we do not drive far for the 4th.  I would actually walk to my Aunt's, but it is all uphill and my hips just can't handle the hills that I would have to walk.  I do walk a lot, but I can't do those hills.  So we drive the 5 minute drive.  We don't do fireworks personally, tho we go to watch the professional fireworks.

My uncle used to smoke a turkey or a ham and we would all make salads.  My Aunt does use plastic forks, but she washes and reuses them until they need to be retired.  We always get corn and as many veggies from the local farmers as we can.  Also fruits for desserts from the local farmers.  My tomatoes are not ready yet so we can't use ours.  Tho I can use my onions

I do see what you are saying tho, you put it into perspective!  Oh yeah and at our house, we very rarely use plastic utensils.  We only have them for the kids school trips or if we go have a picnic.  I don't use paper plates, I haven't bought them in years (except for the special birthday cake plates for the kids.)

[zararina]

I also think it is possible to at least lessen the pollution or garbage if a lot will effort (since harder if all will effort  Lol).
Just like if less will use fireworks, less will use plastics and will use recyclable types of bags, and less will eat too much could make the celebration bit greener.

[Shortpoet-GTD]

QuatreHiead, on 01 July 2012 - 05:08 PM, said:

I suppose the burgers and hot dogs could be left in, by not grilling them but preparing them in home to avoid so much of the GHG emission etc. They would be a bit more expensive, but if you knew of a local producer of the meats that would avoid the whole manufactured sale.

If the cattle and pigs come from a local source, then the emissions from shipping would be reduced, but you'd
still have the emissions from the animals themselves.
http://www.altenergy...ttle-coal-cars/

[Shortpoet-GTD]

Hot dog ingredients you probably don't want to know about. (And that millions of American eaters don't seem
to mind consuming.)
http://blogs.scienti...ents-explained/

[QuatreHiead]

Interesting, didn't quite realize there was that much of an effect for the care of livestock. I suppose I just ideally considered that the farms had been there for some time and were passed through family or something. I don't think I ever would have guessed they would cut down trees and clear area for raising them. I suppose this means I should look a little harder at the history of the many local providers here.

I was however aware that one of the main sources of methane were cattle, just their respiration and digestive system functions creates quite a bit.

Again thanks for the additional information! Food for thought! (Sorry I had to do that pun, couldn't resist.)

[FamilyTreeClimber]

I agree with dconklin.  The point is to try to make changes and to be as green as is possible.  We can't all be perfect in every aspect of our lives.  You can make better choices though.

If you need disposable plates and your area allows you to recycle paper plates (we can put them in our compost/green bin), then they would be an okay option.  Not perfect, but okay.  Choose the paper cups instead of the plastic ones.  I don't see an alternative to plastic utensils except for using regular silverware.

You could buy those poppers instead of lighting fireworks.  They must be a greener option.  Or, go watch a big display instead of adding to the stinky stuff in the air in your own community.

So, I guess you can be a little bit greener if not completely green.

[dconklin]

Shortpoet-GTD, on 02 July 2012 - 02:09 AM, said:

Hot dog ingredients you probably don't want to know about. (And that millions of American eaters don't seem
to mind consuming.)
http://blogs.scienti...ents-explained/

I think if people knew the ingredients before ever trying a hot dog, they wouldn't even want to try them.  But since people try them and like them, the ingredients don't seem to bother them as much.  I do like the taste of hot dogs, but I don't eat them that often.  We have a family member on a low sodium diet and I don't make him eat different stuff as us.  Hot dogs are a rare item here.

[Shortpoet-GTD]

One way some communities are going greener is using laser light shows instead of fireworks.
http://abcnews.go.co...id=97959&page=1

[dconklin]

Shortpoet-GTD, on 03 July 2012 - 03:08 AM, said:

One way some communities are going greener is using laser light shows instead of fireworks.
http://abcnews.go.co...id=97959&page=1

That's an interesting idea! There are firework shows here by me all throughout July and there are even 2 shows in June.  Instead of all getting together, the towns and boroughs all do their own on different days.  They all have their own celebration day and end it with fireworks.  If they could get together and do some together, at least it would lessen too.  We can see most of the celebration fireworks from our house, that is how close together these communities are.

[Shortpoet-GTD]

And this year, out west especially; fireworks are banned.
(It breaks your heart to see all that devastation from the fires.)
They won't be having a holiday this year.

[Shortpoet-GTD]

HAPPY BIRTHDAY AMERICA

[dconklin]

Shortpoet-GTD, on 04 July 2012 - 04:00 AM, said:

HAPPY BIRTHDAY AMERICA

This land was made for you and me :) Happy 4th of July! Hope everybody has a safe holiday

[Shortpoet-GTD]

[MyDigitalpoint]

I never considered all the emissions involved in celebrating America's birthday until reading this thread and then start looking for an answer out there.

I found a nice reading about, 'Green' Fireworks For 4th Of July - Can You Get The Same Boom With Less Pollution?

By that way,

Happy Fourth of July All!

AND REMEMBER THIS FOR THE TIME BEING,

[Shortpoet-GTD]

It's not just the fireworks (which could easily be replaced with laser light shows instead of burning chemicals.)

http://scifun.chem.w...s/fireworks.htm

But it's the foods associated with the holiday-burgers and hot dogs. Bar b queing has potential hazards too.
"Grilling meat produces at least two types of potentially dangerous chemicals: polycyclic aromatic hydrocarbons (PAHs) and heterocyclic amines (HCAs). PAHs are products of imperfect combustion found in smoke and burned matter. In large enough quantities they will definitely cause cancer in humans."
http://www.cancerawa...ausescancer.php
But I do take issue with their use of the word "definitely." Could cause is more likely.
And of course, travel, whether it's by car or plane.
https://docs.google....3NL7FiCw-5W_jgw

But I could just be too nit-picky too.

[Shortpoet-GTD]

As an afterthought- here's an idea.
Cities that are not on fire
could have projected pictures of the states that are on fire.


I think pine trees engulfed in flames would qualify for the statement "bombs bursting in air."

[dconklin]

So sad to see all the fire   

We had a lot of fireworks that everybody purchased and set off all over town last night.  We were at my Aunt's house yesterday and the cops and firetrucks showed up.  They were spraying down the neighbor's yard because of the fireworks they were shooting off.  A couple came real close to my Aunt's house too.

Edit: We personally did not have the fireworks, but people all over town set them off all over.