326 replies to this topic

[Shortpoet-GTD]

Something to consider:
"If critics of global warming science think it shows that climate change is nothing to worry about
because it has happened naturally in the past, that's the wrong conclusion.

"I think the lesson you take away from this is that you don't want to get anywhere close to a mass extinction," Erwin said. "It took 5 million years before life got better again."
http://www.huffingto....html?ref=green

(Btw-4 negative votes from people that were banned from this forum for trolling and spam
and are probably deniers too.)

[gina]

We humans have sience and all the data shows pollution (CO2s and Methane) are causing or at the very least rappidly accelerating global warming. It strange some deny even that.

[mariaandrea]

People will deny anything unless it directly affects them in a dramatic way, like severe weather that damages their home. And even then they'll still deny it. And there really are people who don't care what they world will be like for their grandchildren. They only care about now.

Then there are the people who deny it because they will lose money or status if they admit it's real. Corporations, lobbyists, politicians... Unfortunately, those are the people with most of the real power, so it's become a case of a minority belief ruling over the majority.

[tigerlily78]

I thought we had agreed to call them "reality impaired" or something like that. As I recall "Helpful Gardener" came up with something even better... I should to look that up again and save it for posterity.  

[Shortpoet-GTD]

tigerlily78, on 17 November 2011 - 06:30 PM, said:

I thought we had agreed to call them "reality impaired" or something like that.

Did you try to sidetrack this conversation to the gop?

[Germs]

Not really sure how people can even attempt to deny this, its scientific fact?

[artistry]

The corporations and the politicians who receive gobs of money from them, to support their causes will continue to deny it, until we have
possibly 1,500 mile wide, snow storms in the lower 48 states or something of such magnitude that to deny it would seem insane. But then they dismiss facts now, and keep moving. But time, although it will prove them wrong, will also bring us to a disasterous place. What to do?

[Mon-Jes]

People have a difficult time putting a timescale like 5 million years into the proper perspective, even if they believe in evolution. It's such a large number that your brain squishes it down into a generic "X number of years." So you know it's big, but you don't fully understand just how long that is. So they don't get affected by hearing things like "It will take 5 million years to recover."

[Shortpoet-GTD]

artistry, on 20 November 2011 - 01:09 PM, said:

What to do?

Keep the "powers that be" focused on it via e-mails, tweets, phone calls.
Remind them day after day that we must keep our levels around 350. Even at that level, we'll have issues
with storms, floods and drought, but it could be more manageable. Above that, we're in for it.

[zararina]

Destruction or "shifting naturally" as deniers are saying, is accelerated by human activities.
There are no industries yet releasing too much pollution in the time of the dinosaurs before they got extinct. There are no oil spills before and bombings that leads to destruction of marine animals and natural resources. Believer or not of global warming, we could agree to that fact about how we contribute to earth's destruction. And we should also contribute on how we could somewhat do good things for the environment.

[Shortpoet-GTD]

Germs, on 20 November 2011 - 09:55 AM, said:

Not really sure how people can even attempt to deny this, its scientific fact?

A Reintroduction to the Climate Denying Duo Known as the Koch Brothers

"The Koch brothers use the media to promote their climate denying circus of lies.
Koch Industries is the second largest privately held company in America and the company's owners Charles and David Koch are tied as the fifth wealthiest people in the nation, worth a combined $43 billion.
They earned their fortunes through a host of climate change causing industries including oil refining, ranching, mining, paper products, fertilizer, and chemicals.
They own companies like Georgia Pacific, Invista, Koch Pipeline Company, Flint Hill Resources , Koch Fertilizer and Matador Cattle Company.
If you shop for toilet paper, beef, and fuel you are likely to be indirectly funding the most successful climate change denial machine of the 21st century.

The Kochs have spent $31.3 million since 2005 on organizations that deny or downplay climate change because they have
a vested interest in ignoring environmental conerns."

http://thegreenmarke...enying-duo.html

[ConservativeGreen]

Deniers, I believe, are of two minds.  On one hand you have the Kochs, et al, who are heavily invested in damaging industries but who have the wealth to weather the decline.  Or so they think.  On the other hand you have the people who just can't imagine we could do anything that bad.  We are so inundated with hyperbole in the "news" reporting everything is assumed to be overstated.  Education helps but it is a slow process, it took me years to see.  You can rightly say that climate change is natural and has occured in the past but that does not preclude our influence.  The earth has many natural rhythms, tides, seasons, etc that will go on after we are gone.  We are just adding noise to the rhythm in our little span, and we will either get in tune or be gone.  Ideas that might just be too big for a reality TV populace.

[Shortpoet-GTD]

ConservativeGreen, on 22 November 2011 - 07:26 AM, said:

we will either get in tune or be gone.

Good line.

[Ecodisaster]

Nature is wise, it will know what to do when the time comes. We better be prepared, since we are not changing our ways.

Look at what scientists are saying about extreme weather coming, no joke http://today.msnbc.m...r/#.TsxXwFZjFUs

This is beyond politics at this point. Things are changing on our face.

[Shortpoet-GTD]

They continue to fiddle as Rome burns.
http://www.huffingto...=climate-change

[Belligerent]

I think the reason there are so many deniers (believe me.. I used to be one of them) is that so many people, such as Al Gore, are using the Green Movement as a scheme to make money. People lack logic in realizing that both are true- global warming is real and there are people willing to profit off of it.

I think global warming is becoming harder and harder to deny. We haven't even had a freeze here in Dallas, Texas this year and it's almost December! I actually had my windows open until very recently because the air was rather nice IN November. How strange.

[karmaman]

I think that the people denying it have some kind of plan to escape the planet long before it becomes uninhabitable, but they're betting that scientists will give them the technology to leave first. I would rather just keep the planet liveable instead of trying to find another one to live on since we're evolved to survive here, not in the icy oceans of Europa.

[Shortpoet-GTD]

Belligerent, on 29 November 2011 - 06:39 AM, said:

I used to be one of them) is that so many people, such as Al Gore, are using the Green Movement as
a scheme to make money.

Mr. Gore could make money in numerous ways-giving speeches for one, or writing books.
He's not doing this for money or glory.
He receives death threats for the awareness is trying to bring to people.
Please watch "An inconvenient Truth" before judging him so harshly.
(Hour and a half video)

[Shortpoet-GTD]

More facts for the deniers to ponder.

"2011 is tied for the 10th hottest year since records began in 1850, the office said in its annual assessment of
average global temperatures.
The Arctic sea ice has also shrunk to record-low volumes this year, it said.
The 13 hottest years on the books all have occurred in the last 15 years.

2011 has been a year of extreme weather, the weather service said.
Parching drought in East Africa has left tens of thousands dead, and there have been deadly floods in Asia,
and 14 separate weather catastrophes in the United States with damage topping $1 billion each.

Record high concentrations of greenhouse gases in the atmosphere are fast approaching levels consistent with
another 3.3 F (2.4 C) rise in average global surface temperatures, "which scientists believe could trigger far-reaching and irreversible changes in our Earth, biosphere and oceans," he said.

The largest departure from the norm occurred in northern Russia, where thermometers soared and average 7.2 degrees Fahrenheit (4 degrees Celsius) above average in some places, and some stations reporting spring weather
16 degrees Fahrenheit (9 degrees Celsius) above normal.
The Russian Arctic and most of Siberia hold massive amounts of methane locked into the permafrost, carbon-rich soil that never thaws.
Warmer summer temperatures mean a deeper thaw of permafrost and greater release of methane,
a gas with a global warming potential 23 times more powerful than carbon dioxide."
http://www.msnbc.msn...ws-environment/

[Belligerent]

Shortpoet-GTD, on 29 November 2011 - 10:47 AM, said:

Mr. Gore could make money in numerous ways-giving speeches for one, or writing books.
He's not doing this for money or glory.
He receives death threats for the awareness is trying to bring to people.
Please watch "An inconvenient Truth" before judging him so harshly.
(Hour and a half video)
http://video.google....562857479496579#
http://www.climatecr.../the_impact.php

I've watched "An Inconvenient Truth" and while I am glad for the work he and others are doing, there are always people who take advantage of a bad situation. I don't trust most people in power, Al Gore included. It's not just Al Gore and it's not just global warming.. anyway that people can make money, they will. If he truly 100% cared about the environment, he'd put all of those millions back into taking care of the planet. I don't mean to offend you or anything.. I am just a very cynical person.