I read an article recently that compared climate change deniers to those hundreds of years ago who refused to accept Copernicus' heliocentric model of the universe. They also drew comparisons between climate skeptics and skeptics of Einstein's Theory of Relativity.
Unsettlingly, it took the heliocentric model 200 years to be accepted by the general public.
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16
Deniers.
Started by Shortpoet-GTD, Nov 17 2011 04:40 PM
164 replies to this topic
#62
Posted 06 April 2012 - 03:59 AM
Scott Bartlett, on 06 April 2012 - 03:52 AM, said:
I read an article recently that compared climate change deniers to those hundreds of years ago who refused to accept Copernicus' heliocentric model of the universe. They also drew comparisons between climate skeptics and skeptics of Einstein's Theory of Relativity.
Unsettlingly, it took the heliocentric model 200 years to be accepted by the general public.
Unsettlingly, it took the heliocentric model 200 years to be accepted by the general public.
Pass the butter cause we're burnt toast.
#64
Posted 06 April 2012 - 04:44 PM
Scott Bartlett, on 06 April 2012 - 04:23 AM, said:
I know! That's why I think preaching climate science is one of our most essential tasks.
Not preaching! That's all we hear from the other side. 
Presentation of facts, cajoling, money saving examples. (Although that doesn't always work either.)
#65
Posted 09 April 2012 - 10:59 AM
Shortpoet-GTD, on 22 November 2011 - 04:56 AM, said:
A Reintroduction to the Climate Denying Duo Known as the Koch Brothers
Koch Industries is the second largest privately held company in America and the company's owners Charles and David Koch are tied as the fifth wealthiest people in the nation, worth a combined $43 billion.
They earned their fortunes through a host of climate change causing industries including oil refining, ranching, mining, paper products, fertilizer, and chemicals.
They own companies like Georgia Pacific, Invista, Koch Pipeline Company, Flint Hill Resources , Koch Fertilizer and Matador Cattle Company.
If you shop for toilet paper, beef, and fuel you are likely to be indirectly funding the most successful climate change denial machine of the 21st century.
The Kochs have spent $31.3 million since 2005 on organizations that deny or downplay climate change because they have
a vested interest in ignoring environmental conerns."
http://thegreenmarke...enying-duo.html
Koch Industries is the second largest privately held company in America and the company's owners Charles and David Koch are tied as the fifth wealthiest people in the nation, worth a combined $43 billion.
They earned their fortunes through a host of climate change causing industries including oil refining, ranching, mining, paper products, fertilizer, and chemicals.
They own companies like Georgia Pacific, Invista, Koch Pipeline Company, Flint Hill Resources , Koch Fertilizer and Matador Cattle Company.
If you shop for toilet paper, beef, and fuel you are likely to be indirectly funding the most successful climate change denial machine of the 21st century.
The Kochs have spent $31.3 million since 2005 on organizations that deny or downplay climate change because they have
a vested interest in ignoring environmental conerns."
http://thegreenmarke...enying-duo.html
It is crystal clear how hypocrites can they be in denying that global warming is not a thing to worry about. I wished that they be placed under the heat of the sun from 9AM-3PM and then tell us again that there is no such thing to worry about global warming. They had billions already, I hope they will have the conscience to invest back to Earth what they got from her. :(
#66
Posted 09 April 2012 - 11:12 AM
Most of it is meant to protect their big oil company friends, so that they will continue to show them the money. Some of them would confess to belief in global warming, if not for fear of losing the contributions from all those who are profiting, from doing nothing about it.
#67
Posted 14 April 2012 - 04:26 AM
I don't know how they can still be denying climate change with this overwhelming evidence, but they do.
"According to the U.S. National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration,
last month was the hottest March on record for the United States since 1895, when records were first kept,
with average temperatures of 8.6 degrees F above average.
More than 15,000 March high-temperature records were broken nationally.
Drought, wildfires, tornadoes and other extreme weather events are already plaguing the country.
Across the world in the Maldives, rising sea levels continue to threaten this Indian Ocean archipelago.
It is the world’s lowest-lying nation, on average only 1.3 meters above sea level.
Dr. Jeff Masters of the weather website Weather Underground blogged about March that
“records not merely smashed, but obliterated.”
Texas lists 1,000 of the state’s 4,710 community water systems under restrictions.
Spicewood, Texas, population 1,100, has run dry, and is now getting water trucked in.
Residents have severe restrictions on water use.
But for Perry,
restricting corporations whose greenhouse-gas emissions lead to climate change is heresy.
The American Legislative Exchange Council, or ALEC, has been promoting legislation in statehouses to oppose any climate legislation.
ALEC is funded by the country’s major polluters, including ExxonMobil, BP America, Chevron,
Peabody Energy, and Koch Industries."
http://www.commondre...tBQQvhU.twitter
I understand that the koch brothers and the big oil companies want to make money hand over fist. And have
absolute control over the remaining populations of the world, once climate change kills off millions of people;
but as "smart" as they may think they are-they fail to realize that they will have to "live" on this polluted planet
once the rest of us are dead and gone.
I guess they can shop til they drop for oxygen machines.
(Gold covered oxygen machines, btw.)
I wonder where they think they will get clean water from? Shipped in from another planet?
"According to the U.S. National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration,
last month was the hottest March on record for the United States since 1895, when records were first kept,
with average temperatures of 8.6 degrees F above average.
More than 15,000 March high-temperature records were broken nationally.
Drought, wildfires, tornadoes and other extreme weather events are already plaguing the country.
Across the world in the Maldives, rising sea levels continue to threaten this Indian Ocean archipelago.
It is the world’s lowest-lying nation, on average only 1.3 meters above sea level.
Dr. Jeff Masters of the weather website Weather Underground blogged about March that
“records not merely smashed, but obliterated.”
Texas lists 1,000 of the state’s 4,710 community water systems under restrictions.
Spicewood, Texas, population 1,100, has run dry, and is now getting water trucked in.
Residents have severe restrictions on water use.
But for Perry,
restricting corporations whose greenhouse-gas emissions lead to climate change is heresy.The American Legislative Exchange Council, or ALEC, has been promoting legislation in statehouses to oppose any climate legislation.
ALEC is funded by the country’s major polluters, including ExxonMobil, BP America, Chevron,
Peabody Energy, and Koch Industries."
http://www.commondre...tBQQvhU.twitter
I understand that the koch brothers and the big oil companies want to make money hand over fist. And have
absolute control over the remaining populations of the world, once climate change kills off millions of people;
but as "smart" as they may think they are-they fail to realize that they will have to "live" on this polluted planet
once the rest of us are dead and gone.
I guess they can shop til they drop for oxygen machines.
(Gold covered oxygen machines, btw.)I wonder where they think they will get clean water from? Shipped in from another planet?
#68
Posted 14 April 2012 - 09:16 AM
A climate scientist and a denier walk into a bar. The climate scientists asks the bartender-show me your strongest alcohol, the bartender says oh that easy here it is its 90 proof, the denier gets mad and walks out.
The climate scientist looks at the bartender and says; you know that’s just like those guys,
“You show them the PROOF and they still don’t buy it.”
People like the Koch brothers will do everything they can to deny the proof of climate science because all they care about is making the addiction to fossil fuel worse in the United States to make more and more money, cause the more we use, the less there is, which means it goes up in price and they make more money. And that is no joke.
The climate scientist looks at the bartender and says; you know that’s just like those guys,
“You show them the PROOF and they still don’t buy it.”
People like the Koch brothers will do everything they can to deny the proof of climate science because all they care about is making the addiction to fossil fuel worse in the United States to make more and more money, cause the more we use, the less there is, which means it goes up in price and they make more money. And that is no joke.
#69
Posted 14 April 2012 - 10:20 AM
Shortpoet-GTD, on 14 April 2012 - 04:26 AM, said:
I don't know how they can still be denying climate change with this overwhelming evidence, but they do......
Money. For some, anyway.
Upton Sinclair:
"It is difficult to get a man to understand something, when his salary depends upon his not understanding it!" http://en.wikiquote..../Upton_Sinclair
Not just salary, but all income.
Also, adherence to "free market fundamentalism." http://en.wikipedia...._fundamentalism
All governmental regulation affecting markets and commerce and private enterprise is rejected by free market fundamentalists. Including all environmental regulation, especially including greenhouse gas regulation.
Fundamentalism is easier for some, no need to think.
#70
Posted 14 April 2012 - 07:29 PM
Maybe, just maybe, one of the major corporate deniers is beginning to change their tune:
http://ideas.time.co...st-ad-campaign/
Could it be that somebody high enough up in the corporate ladder has realized that continued denial will eventually be bad for business?
http://ideas.time.co...st-ad-campaign/
Could it be that somebody high enough up in the corporate ladder has realized that continued denial will eventually be bad for business?
#71
Posted 15 April 2012 - 07:35 AM
It is always easier to deny that your house is messy rather than admit it and clean up. What these global warming deniers fail to address is that even if global warming weren't real, the steps that are being taken to fight it will still be beneficial to our environment both now and in the long run. Just think about it, even if ice caps weren't melting, shouldn't we be conserving water, recycling and finding alternative energy solutions anyway?
#72
Posted 16 April 2012 - 12:24 PM
meowcow, on 15 April 2012 - 07:35 AM, said:
It is always easier to deny that your house is messy rather than admit it and clean up. What these global warming deniers fail to address is that even if global warming weren't real, the steps that are being taken to fight it will still be beneficial to our environment both now and in the long run. Just think about it, even if ice caps weren't melting, shouldn't we be conserving water, recycling and finding alternative energy solutions anyway?
I'm pretty sure your argument won't convince any denier.
Recycling and water conservation don't affect ongoing climate change that much.
I see global warning/climate change deniers falling into three or four categories:
Firstly, there are businesses that deny for monetary reasons. Some of those that are built on fossil fuel extraction and use see loss of profit, maybe loss of livelihood and loss of wealth in a shift away from fossil fuels. They deny and some help fund the professional deniers.
Secondly there are the professional deniers. Individuals and organizations, funded by first category mostly, to lobby and otherwise promote climate change disinformation. Individuals like Monckton and organizations like Heartland Institute.
Thirdly, there are those individuals that have the view that "Green is the new Red." Some of the reactionary political or religious persuasion just see those of us who advance any kind of environmental arguments at all that seek to limit polluting activities of business as anticapitalist, as antiAmerican (or antiBritish or antiCanadian or whatever).
Fourthly, there are those who have been convinced by the other three categories.
In you messy house analogy, the first two categories don't care if there is a mess or not. The third category thinks the mess is good. The fourth doesn't think that climate change is part of the mess.
In defense of the fourth category, limiting choices or spending money to fix a mess that isn't real would be a waste. Subsidizing renewable energy if climate change weren't real would be a waste. Just let market forces do the job of letting the best forms of energy come out on top. The mess is real though, just not that big yet. It will get outlandishly big though if we let it.
Also, there are a lot of individuals who simply don't care. Some have more pressing problems. Some are slobs. Some just don't think.
#74
Posted 17 May 2012 - 03:36 AM
Deniers won't view this link but perhaps others will. Alarming study.
"Post-1950s warming in the Australasian region is unmatched by any climate fluctuations over the past 1,000 years,
according to the first large-scale temperature reconstruction for the area.
Lead researcher, Dr Joelle Gergis from the University of Melbourne’s School of Earth Sciences,
said the results showed there were no other warm periods in the past 1,000 years that matched the warming experienced in Australasia since 1950.
The study is part of the PAGES (Past Global Changes) global collaboration to reconstruct the past 2,000 years
of climate across every region in the world."
Here
"Post-1950s warming in the Australasian region is unmatched by any climate fluctuations over the past 1,000 years,
according to the first large-scale temperature reconstruction for the area.
Lead researcher, Dr Joelle Gergis from the University of Melbourne’s School of Earth Sciences,
said the results showed there were no other warm periods in the past 1,000 years that matched the warming experienced in Australasia since 1950.
The study is part of the PAGES (Past Global Changes) global collaboration to reconstruct the past 2,000 years
of climate across every region in the world."
Here
#75
Posted 03 July 2012 - 03:31 AM
Washington Post climate change cartoons-
(don't forgot to read the small caption on the bottom right of them-they're the funniest.)
http://www.washingto...y.html#photo=24
(don't forgot to read the small caption on the bottom right of them-they're the funniest.)
http://www.washingto...y.html#photo=24
#76
Posted 08 July 2012 - 03:46 AM
Even though this article speaks to the fact that more people believe in climate change, (at about 62% now)
I can't help but wonder why there was a drop off from the fall of 2008 when it stood at 75%?
The numbers are rising again, but why the drop off in the first place? (see chart in link)
http://thinkprogress...r-temperatures/
Why did it drop in the spring of 2010-right before the baggers got elected? Propaganda ads?
http://www.brookings...rabe_borick.pdf
I can't help but wonder why there was a drop off from the fall of 2008 when it stood at 75%?
The numbers are rising again, but why the drop off in the first place? (see chart in link)
http://thinkprogress...r-temperatures/
Why did it drop in the spring of 2010-right before the baggers got elected? Propaganda ads?
http://www.brookings...rabe_borick.pdf
#78
Posted 18 July 2012 - 01:57 PM
Some times it takes a child's eyes, to see the simplest truth.
http://www.altenergy...-of-change-r821
http://www.altenergy...-of-change-r821
#79
Posted 19 July 2012 - 11:52 AM
This 2011 survey (recently released) is very disheartening.
The so called generation x is not worried about it, and the percentages of people that think it's a real issue
are declining.
Maybe they're not old enough to compare? The droughts, the strength of tornadoes, the floods-
the heat?
Forecast here will be high 90's-triple digits for the foreseeable future. I've only lived in the panhandle of Texas
since 1984 but we never used to have this kind of heat for weeks on end.
How can they not see it as reality?
http://www.msnbc.msn...ws-environment/
The so called generation x is not worried about it, and the percentages of people that think it's a real issue
are declining.
Maybe they're not old enough to compare? The droughts, the strength of tornadoes, the floods-
the heat?
Forecast here will be high 90's-triple digits for the foreseeable future. I've only lived in the panhandle of Texas
since 1984 but we never used to have this kind of heat for weeks on end.
How can they not see it as reality?
http://www.msnbc.msn...ws-environment/
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